Going Shopping [Open]

[Oswald Cobblepot]

The troll market has been a tradition among the scum of the world for generations. Though in Gotham it started out as mostly pickpockets selling their stolen goods under bridges it had grown and today with the rogues infamy in the city causing great creative chaos if there was any solid form of an actual black market this was it. They say that you could get anything in a place like this. Paintings, people, assassins, jewellery, explosives, poisons, weapons, secrets and much more could all be found for a price. Never in the same place it was found by the good old traditional network of knowing someone who knew someone who heard things.

Oswald of course knew people. Secretly Oswald was people for though he'd never admit to being involved the arrangements of moving, expanding and setting up the market as it was today it was a business he helped manage at a distance under the names of people who didn't even know who was in charge.
There were a number of reasons he didn't want his name connected to this place. The police of course was one but the primary reason was to maintain the neutrality of the place. Fights were to be left outside under pain of being shot on site because the market had to maintain the appearance of being apart from the gangs and somewhere anyone could come and spend their dubiously acquired money at. Oswald may hate a lot of people but for most of them he was willing to look the other way for a night if it meant he profited out of it and it always paid to see what your enemies are buying for an insight in to their plans.

Tonight the market had taken over a multi-storey car park which had officially been closed for maintenance and boarded off for several days beforehand with builders coming and going since then. Today the only people dressed as builders on site were the guards keeping a lookout for trouble while inside wares were being bought, sold or arranged to be delivered to the desired location later. It was all a temporary set up, designed to allow people to grab their things and scatter if anyone started poking around but they had set up a small bar with drinks and food out of the side of a truck.

Oswald had his usual scotch with him as he browsed through the selection of cars on offer. There were more than usual owing to the ease of getting them in to the building this time and while Oswald preferred the more stylish classic cars he was currently perusing an armoured humvee that looked like it should have gone to some war zone instead of ending up in the middle of Gotham. He had a few men in the building, some buying on his behalf from a list he'd provided, several selling but for Oswald himself it was more of an occasion to browse and see what favours he could attract.

[Victor Fries]

Victor didn't necessarily know very many people, but the same couldn't be said of some of his men. Though he'd attracted some new faces into his employ, others had worked as criminals for years - either independently or for others. So it was easy enough for them to catch wind of the time and place of the market. They didn't always attend, but there was a periodic need to do so.

While it wasn't quite true that one could get literally anything at the market and they now had a very lucrative deal with Maroni to find all the things that couldn't be found at such a place, there were many smaller deals to be made that were too trivial to bring to that nevertheless greatly valued contact. Both to buy and to sell - any time Victor made a robbery and relieved the bystanders of their valuables on top of whatever the actual goal had been they ended up with a whole host of items that would find a buyer in the market. It was also a very good place for his men to restock or upgrade some of their gear - especially for those with a long rap sheet, who didn't dare set foot in a legitimate gun store.

As those who were shopping browsed what was on offer, a few were left at the nondescript white van to sell what they had - stolen credit cards and IDs, jewelry, watches, and other valuables from their last robbery, and some also knew to come to them if they were interested in buying or selling various chemicals. There was nothing overtly visible to connect them to the notorious Mr. Freeze, though they did habitually tend to dress a bit warmly for the weather. The sheer amount of what they were selling was perhaps a clue, but then again those who didn't know who they were already might merely think that the items had simply been collected over a longer period of time.

Of course, one of the more interesting things about the market was that, while there were certain things one could always expect to find, there was always the unexpected. This was why three of Victor's most senior and trusted men took the time to look at the vehicles being sold. They didn't think that their boss needed to expand upon what he already had, but then again it was possible that the right one would change things.

The more flashy vehicles were given an immediate pass as Victor was very much into being as discrete as possible at all times, but there was a large utility truck that prompted a huddled discussion. It all might have been easier if Victor was present to consider such a large purchase, but he trusted his men enough to give them a lot of leeway and, if needed, he was a phone call away. Not that they didn't hesitate to call him when he was so easily bothered by interruptions to his work - in fact, the need to not only to discuss whether or not to purchase the vehicle but also whether or not to consult with the boss lengthened the discussion considerably, distracting them from paying much attention to those passing by. Not that they had much of a concern about that because of the strictly enforced neutrality of the market.

[Oswald Cobblepot]

The value of the market was perhaps more in its connections than it's goods. Networking in the criminal world often came with the threat of getting ones head cut off for sticking it too far out of ones hole and in to someone else's business. At least here beheading was banned so if you find out the guy you've been speaking to about running guns to the south side is actually working for someone who wants you dead you probably at least have enough time to part ways and skip town for a bit rather than getting instantly shot instead.
Even being able to see the goods was some advantage of course since it cut out the irritating conmen who wasted time merely pretending to have what they were trying to sell.

Oswald had provided lists for his men when it came to chemicals, what to buy, what not to buy, who to call if it wasn't on either list. The person they called was of course not Ozzy himself, he doesn't need to be answering stupid questions when they read things wrong.
He has people who knew jewellery to go around and find the good items but Oswald had no need for IDs when he could make them and credit cards were practically always shut down within hours of a robbery. There was always someone who would buy these things anyway for some scam but Oswald usually had bigger plans in mind than a little credit card fraud.

Oswald wasn't committed to the Humvee, it was perhaps a little obvious and difficult to manoeuvre. He would sooner armour his own cars and be able to travel with a little more style but he was browsing until a salesman tried to approach him in the hope of making a sale. He held up a finger to make the man pause and then he walked away. A legitimate car salesman was a pain to deal with, they were even worse here if you let them start talking without a clear deal in mind.

Cobblepot spotted Freeze's men huddled together almost instantly as he was leaving. The clothes were a subtle giveaway but the real clue for him was that several of his men went to work for Freeze so every so often he spots a familiar face. He approaches the group regardless of their clear desire to talk amongst themselves "Freeze is still avoiding public appearances I see" he said as he briefly raised his hat to the group.

[Victor Fries]

As distracted as the men were by their conversation, they were not so distracted as to not notice when their group was being intentionally approached instead of merely passed by. Their conversation ended immediately, though not necessarily because they had a need to worry about anyone overhearing anything - the pros and cons of the truck and whether or not to bother the boss about it made for a rather dry conversation to anyone who wouldn't be affected by the outcome. The reason was simply that they wished to determine who was interrupting them and whether or not to tell whoever it was to move along.

Though when they saw who it was, that was enough to give them some pause on its own. Though Victor had many instances of men joining and leaving his employ over the past year, all three gathered here happened to have been with him from the very beginning. This meant that all of them were former employees of Oswald - Cory, Harry, and Juan if he cared to remember - and this, of course, made things a little awkward since they hadn't exactly left with a proper two weeks notice. And all of them were also quite familiar with how uncertain things stood at present between Oswald and their boss.

On the other hand, since that time Victor had made quite the name for himself, and had left Oswald entirely alone. That, combined with the venue, meant that when the flicker of surprise that he was talking to them in the first place ended, they looked reasonably confident and relaxed about it - they were all quite familiar with Oswald's temper, but they knew that Oswald knew that their boss had one too. So unless Oswald wanted to start something, which seemed unlikely, this was fine.

Harry took a step back to open up their little circle, shrugging as he commented, "The boss thinks he has better things to do than to come to things like this." He worded the statement carefully so as to be neutral on the subject, neither criticizing his boss for not coming nor implying that Oswald must not have as many important things to do since he did come.

"Yeah, and he ain't exactly sociable, and there's only a few things he might care about. He'd be bored to tears," Juan said with a nod.

"Besides, we know our business, so he trusts us with his," Cory supplied, his voice light but with a certain subtle undercurrent to it.

In fact, though all three men were most definitely being polite, there was a certain overly pleased quality to their expressions. Oswald probably didn't remember how many times he'd told each of them that he didn't pay them to think, but they did. Not that any of them would make an issue out of the past, but they were allowed to quietly feel things about it.

[Oswald Cobblepot]

Oswald's temper was an ever present thing. There was never a time when some bit of the man wasn't angry about something but until that something became big enough for the anger to break the surface it remained bottled up inside, hidden behind the smiles, pomp and polite etiquette that Cobblepot bound himself to. Yes, Oswald didn't like the men. They had betrayed him and run off to work for the living icicle. If anything he disliked them more than any opinion he had on Freeze. At least since Victor didn't seem to have a personality to call his own Oswald was quite sure anything to do with the man was just business rather than anything personal.

Victor had of course done quite well for himself. Oswald would still have preferred the man work for him and do as he's told, just as he'd prefer everyone do that but for a man with no experience in operating in the underworld of Gotham when the Penguin had met him Freeze had earnt his place.

Oswald was at least quite happy to see the awkwardness of his former employees. Serves them right for leaving. If Oswald had it his way no one would get to leave outside of a body bag. He couldn't however kill the men here of course and Victor would probably take exception to it. Oswald may not particularly like the men but they simply weren't worth making a war out of.

Cobblepot raised an eyebrow at Harry. Despite the careful wording Ozzy was trying to decide if that was meant to be a jab at him. He didn't comment until Juan had said his bit though "It is sad to see he still cannot see the potential benefits to leaving his igloo on occasion but Victor has never exactly been the life of the party. Perhaps he many at least be convinced to come to cards at least once?" because the rogues do occasionally cross paths for drinks and gambling.

Looking at the truck after Cory's comment Ozzy seemed to be taking a moment to study it. Even if he didn't want it it might be beneficial to memorise the details in case Freeze did buy it "Really? Has his current transportation been encountering problems again?" he didn't know if their vehicles had any problems really but there was typically always something wrong with a car and by saying again he made it sound like he already knew something.

Ozzy didn't care for their opinions or whether or not he'd hurt their precious feelings by telling them so in the past. He employed people to do what they're told and paid them for it accordingly. If he had to give them money he should at least be able to expect a certain level of unquestioning loyalty.

[Victor Fries]

Was it personal for any of these men when they left Oswald's employ? That was a difficult question to answer because their reasons more or less amounted to their belief that Victor appreciated their talents more than Oswald had, and paid them accordingly. How much of that was simply taking a better deal and how much of that was a matter of personal resentment was difficult to determine because it was some of both.

Not that it even mattered when nobody was planning on doing anything to anyone - especially not there and then. It was always possible that Victor and Oswald would be at odds at some point in the future but, for now, there was no reason not to maintain the peace. In fact, it only took a few moments for the discomfort of the men to begin to ease once they saw that they were all indeed talking and all was well.

If Harry had meant to insult Oswald, his expression didn't betray as much. He thought that he'd made a statement of fact and nothing more, even though he recognized that it was possible to take it the wrong way. But Harry was quiet when Oswald responded to Juan's words with the mention of a game of cards. Juan, on the other hand, did not suppress a loud and immediate guffaw. Turning his attention mostly to Cory, he asked, "Can you imagine - the boss playing cards?"

Cory also looked amused, though somewhat less so. "Well, if the thought he'd win..."

"Oh, true - the boss does like money," Juan conceded as his humor eased.

There was a slight pause after Oswald's question about the state of Victor's vehicles as all three men momentarily considered whether or not it was an insult. Did Oswald know that Victor got personally involved in alterations to their vehicles when something more than routine maintenance was needed? But Harry was the quickest to decide how to answer that, and said, "Actually, we've been expanding." And the way that Harry said it seemed to hint that he meant that in general, and not just when it came to vehicles. A moment later both Juan and Cory nodded to confirm - yes, that's was probably the right thing to say.

Which was no small statement to make, partly because that could mean several things and partly because regardless of what it meant that would have an effect on others in the city. However, neither Harry nor the other two seemed to be immediately inclined to explain it any further than that.

[Oswald Cobblepot]

Oswald liked things done a certain way. His way. The problem with trusting people to come up with ideas and enact them was people did things differently and the majority of the time they also did them incompetently. There were likely a few bright sparks within Oswald's employ who could think far enough ahead to at least pass the most basic of Neanderthal tests and successfully rub two sticks together without setting themselves on fire and these were probably the people who also didn't annoy Oswald constantly and eventually got thrown in to additional work but the vast majority of them were thugs. Hired goons. Guns, there to bully and intimidate. Ozzy paid people with the relevant skills if he wanted something special, he knew who to go to for explosive experts, engineering, technical knowledge, his average man on the street was paid for one thing; to do as they were told.

Which made it rather irritating when some of them branched off and now seem to consider themselves special because Victor trusted them to go shopping for him. Oswald really did wish he could have bypassed the bottom rung of the ladder and just dealt with Freeze directly instead. Though given the man was as cold and desolate of personality as his preferred environment perhaps talking to the grunts would yield more information than the ice man would typically have bestowed.

"I heard his last series of heists were quite successful in that department" Oswald said idly at the mention of Victor liking money. That was no news, everyone liked money. Everyone needed it. Someone like Victor would need it especially if he wanted to keep fuelling his research and Oswald knew he would never stop that, not so long as Nora lived. Oswald assumed she still lived. He really wasn't sure which way Freeze would go if she didn't.

The word that they were expanding was partial news but to be expected with someone of Victor's growing notoriety "Should I come to expect more poaching of best men?" Oswald joked dryly, trying to sound jovial about the whole thing despite the slight hint of bitterness. He really didn't consider them his best men, far from it, but if they wanted to think he was annoyed about losing them beyond the principle of the matter he wasn't going to dissuade them from the idea "Maroni will no doubt scrambling to keep up already" Oswald knew about the deal with Maroni, mostly through process of elimination. If they weren't doing business with Oswald there were only so many people in Gotham who could provide Victor with the things he needed.

[Victor Fries]

Though all three of these men had been initially hired by Oswald as thugs and goons and weren't exactly specialists, it was also the case with each of them that they'd spent several years in some combination working for other criminals or Oswald himself. And unlike those who'd gotten themselves fired, arrested, killed, or who were simply too unintelligent to learn anything, they'd acquired skills over the course of the job. The trouble was those skills tended to be in areas such as planning, negotiation, leadership, and other subjects that Oswald preferred to reserve for himself, so they found themselves working in a job with no opportunity for advancement.

The very fact that even now Oswald thought himself talking to the bottom rung of the ladder was exactly the problem. The true bottom rung of Victor's organization right now were the poor saps given the tedious job of staying with the van and selling what they'd brought to sell - these three, on the other hand, were very close to the top of the ladder. Granted, Victor's entire organization wasn't really comparable to Oswald's as far as numbers were concerned, so it was a much shorter ladder, but it was definitely a promotion.

When Oswald commented on the proceeds of their most recent heists, he'd see flickers of satisfaction and pride on all of their faces - not every heist was an all-hands-on-deck affair, but they'd each had their turn being directly involved. "In and out before the cops get there..." Harry boasted as if it was all very easy. And it was... if everything worked out perfectly. As if to moderate that, Juan added, "Of course, the cops - and Batman, for that matter - are always trying out new tactics." It was definitely true that some of Victor's heists definitely didn't go according to the plan and got very messy indeed, and in a few a sizable chunk of Victor's men didn't make it back - though Oswald was now talking to three who were very good at making sure that they were among the few that did. "But so does the boss - always pushing that envelope..." Juan continued, as it was also very true that each heist tended to build upon the previous ones, becoming more brazen and sophisticated over time.

Of course, the joke about Oswald's best men had an obvious retort, and Harry couldn't help but make it. "He can't do that again - he's already got us," he said with an arrogant grin, earning a playful shove in the arm from Juan. Cory, however, seemed to take it more seriously and ignored his associates as he commented, "That's a strong word: poaching. As I remember it, you played dirty with him, so he played dirty with you. The boss likes to keep out of the dirt otherwise." The words quickly squelched the humor out of the other two, and Juan in particular gave Cory a subtle, concerned expression hinting that perhaps he shouldn't be taking the conversation in that particular direction. That, in turn, prompted Cory to add, "I mean no disrespect..." Which was something he could say with full sincerity, at least.

At the name 'Maroni' being said out loud, the small ripple it caused between all three men probably confirmed what Oswald already thought he knew - Cory frowned slightly but kept his mouth shut, Juan could be seen subtly looking around their group to see exactly who might be in eavesdropping range, and Harry actually looked slightly surprised but then commented, "Let's just say that since we fixed up our supply chain all nice, it's really expanded the horizons." Naturally, since they were talking about a very big mob family they certainly couldn't say anything about it.

[Oswald Cobblepot]

"Of course" Oswald repeated as he casually reached in to a pocket for his cigarettes while he talked "Law enforcement has always been an inconvenient distraction to such endeavours, to say nothing of Batman's interference" he said, his eyes briefly drifting over a number of shadows around the parking structure when the Bat got mentioned. It was a force of habit many had probably picked up over the years "A large successful heist does make up for the misfortune of the Bat's persistent interest" he was referring to the previous heists that didn't go to plan but continued talking on so smoothly it was practically impossible to tell if it was a jab or not "But I do hear Blackgate is quite seasonable of late, though the construction due to begin on the east side in two weeks is sure to change that" he made it all sound so casual, like if he ever said anything that caused consequences that was entirely accidental. In reality he wasn't necessarily planning anything, he just hated Blackgate and was happy to spread around the impending potential weak spot.

"Heh" Oswald failed to laugh at Harry's retort, giving him a long, dry, flat look instead but he made no attempt to correct the man, he wasn't worth the time "Played him dirty? I wouldn't say that" he replied to Cory instead, he was idly curious just what they thought happened because Oswald certainly wouldn't have been giving them the big picture "No, please, do continue" he said to Cory's assurance that disrespect was not intended, finally pulling out a lighter to use on his cigarette while he invited the man to try and not dig himself in to a hole.

Oswald considered the bottom rung of the ladder to be quite incredibly large when it came to talking to people employed by criminals, he was quite generous and more than willing to include everyone who mistakenly thought their opinion mattered on it. Sometimes not even the right hand man of a rogue was worth the time it took to speak to them in Ozzy's opinion, if their boss would turn around and go against their word then there was really no point in dealing with them. His opinion of everyone was low but this bunch? The fact that they seemed to have become deluded in to thinking they mattered was almost pitiful. As grunts they had their uses but there was one important thing that hadn't changed, no matter how much work Victor might dump on them, at the end of the day they were all still easily replaceable.

There were people in Oswald's organisation he would find harder to replace than others but any good boss must have a plan in place in case their employee gets hit by a bus, or locked up by the cops, or shot by another gang, it was a dangerous world out there. He'd never needed a plan for these three at all, someone could have stepped in to their role the moment they dropped dead when they'd worked for him and he couldn't imagine that their deaths would put so much as a stumbled step in to the march of a man like Freeze.

He did so love it when people confirmed his suspicions without saying a word. He could tell just by looking at them that he'd been right about Maroni, not that he'd ever doubted it in the first place "Really? Expanding beyond simple bank robbery? How unusually entrepreneurial for Freeze" he knew Victor's main interest was always his wife and research, if anything the fact he wasn't another mad man fighting to control Gotham was a good thing, he couldn't really imagine that would have changed now.

[Victor Fries]

Mention of the Bat was enough to set most professional criminals to check their surroundings and Victor's men were not exceptions to this, but their paranoia was on the lighter side. Their boss's tactics not only meant that actually seeing the vigilante didn't happen very often, and when it did happen Victor handled that problem personally. Therefore Batman didn't seem nearly as threatening to them as he would to Oswald - at least not when compared to the threat of the cops.

Both were problems, but they seemed far away among this black market gathering as they spoke about their success. Which was a part of the reason why none of the men took any notice of the possible jab at their occasional failures, though most of it was that they simply weren't very concerned with them at all. Instead, Harry grinned and commented, "Yes, it sure does!" These men felt that they were on easy street, for the most part.

What did get their notice was the mention of Blackgate, partly because none of them had forgotten how Oswald was with information during the past year. But though all three of them paid careful attention to the comment, it was notable that none of them showed no more interest in it than that even when they'd heard the whole of it. "Is that so?" asked Juan, just making conversation, "First I've heard of it." New information, but apparently not anything that they thought was immediately interesting in spite of the fact that they all knew their boss had managed to break into the facility before, and that time without an easy weakness. None of these three had been a part of the actual team that went, but those that did told everyone the tale when they got back.

With the mixed reception to what he'd already said coming from the other two men, Cory seemed hesitant to say more even with Oswald's encouragement, but after a brief pause he ventured to add, "You did try to mess with the only thing he actually cares about." He then shrugged as if to indicate that he'd made his point but he wasn't exactly heavily invested in arguing about just how dirty or not that was. Even criminals usually had standards and most would agree that certain things were crossing the line, but exactly where that line was and which things were on the other side of it got extremely hazy very quickly on their side of the law.

Especially since it often depended not only on who did what but exactly to whom they did it. In the absence of laws attempting to constrain people's behavior so that everyone pretended to be more or less equal, the landscape was instead one measured by respect gained from power. Cory's opinion that Oswald's actions were 'dirty' was therefore most likely either a sign that he had some sort of personal qualm about the incident or he thought that Oswald hadn't shown his boss a sufficient amount of respect in even making the attempt.

In spite of the subtle tension caused by such talk, Harry seemed to be the least affected so he felt content enough to ramble, "Well, bank robbery isn't all it's cracked up to be these days anyway - most currency is digital now so we need to get a solid tip just to know when one actually has enough cash for it to be worth it. And since the boss has shown he can get into their vaults no problem they've been trying to keep as much of it as possible far enough away that it would be a bother for us to go get it." This basically confirmed that Victor's motives hadn't changed and he was likely still after money, but it seemed that he was now planning on doing so in a less direct fashion than literally grabbing money.

Not that Victor had never robbed anything other than a bank. He'd robbed laboratories more than once, for equally obvious reasons, as well as a number of jewelry stores - which made sense because jewelry was really easy to fence. But talk of expansion certainly implied that he wasn't planning on simply doing more of that either.